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ForumsDosing & ProtocolsDe-escalation protocols — my results so far

De-escalation protocols — my results so far

pam_columbus Sun, Aug 4, 2024 at 5:28 AM 14 replies 1,985 viewsPage 1 of 3
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pam_columbus
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Columbus, OH
Aug 4, 2024 at 5:28 AM#1

I titrated faster than the label because I felt fine, hit a wall at the third step, and had to come back down — which I now think was the predictable outcome rather than bad luck.

The arithmetic in one line: half-life about a week, so steady state at four to five weeks, so a four-week interval is one steady state per step. Two-week intervals mean every step is dosed onto a rising curve.

What I am after is why the interval is four weeks rather than two, and whether a slower ladder gets to the same place.

Numbers rather than impressions, if you have them.

45 15kevin_tulsa, Dr.PainCLE, mike_mealprep and 42 others
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Dr.PeteFamMed
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Aug 4, 2024 at 6:14 AM#2

Short answer first, then the reasoning. The trials generally allowed a step to be held or reduced and then retried, and people who did that mostly arrived at the same place a few weeks later. The end point of the ladder is set by tolerability, not by a schedule, and there is no evidence that reaching the top faster produces a better outcome.

44 14tommy_boulder, hyun_seoul, jim_asheville and 41 others
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MikeNYC_runner
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Aug 4, 2024 at 7:00 AM#3
Dr.PeteFamMed said:
The trials generally allowed a step to be held or reduced and then retried, and people who did that mostly arrived at the same place a few weeks…

That is right for the weekly injectables. For the daily agents the interval logic is different and the four-week convention does not transfer.

Last edited: Aug 4, 2024 at 9:00 AM
43 13Dr.ObesityMed, HealthEcon_DC, PedsEndoPhilly and 40 others
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AussieAnna
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Aug 4, 2024 at 7:46 AM#4
pam_columbus said:
I titrated faster than the label because I felt fine, hit a wall at the third step, and had to come back down — which I now think was the predictable…

Same position here, arrived at the long way round. Four weeks is the pharmacokinetics, not caution. With a one-week half-life you need four to five half-lives to reach steady state, so at two weeks you are dosing on top of a concentration that has not finished rising. Escalating then stacks exposure and you get the side-effect burden of the higher dose before you have seen the benefit of the current one.

Last edited: Aug 4, 2024 at 8:46 AM
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Dr.DermMIA
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Aug 4, 2024 at 12:04 PM#5

Adding the clinical framing, because it changes how the question reads.

Dose escalation anxiety for titration: I was terrified to move from 0.5mg to 1.0mg based on horror stories in this forum. But my actual experience? Slightly more appetite suppression, zero additional side effects.

Remember that the people posting about terrible side effects are a biased sample. Most people titrate up without drama — they just don't post about it because it's uneventful.

41 11SurmountFan_IN, PeptideChemSF, A1cHero_PHX and 38 others
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